Friday Night Open Thread: Politics Allowed

 385 replies

Welcome to AG’s nightly Open Thread, drop in and join a conversation, or start one yourself.

Given the political events of today we decided it was best to have a separate thread for those who want to discuss it, and this is the place to do so.

With that in mind, it doesn’t mean it’s a free for all. While discussion can get heated, please keep the discussion respectful and refrain from personal attacks.

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upamtn
06/24/2022 10:59 pm

seeya kids … crash & burn time for the old hippie

EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:38 pm

Well, getting ready to leave. We have once again proved that we can have political discourse without resorting to personal attacks on what is probably the most controversial issue we have dealt with. Respect to all here who pulled that feat off. Now, we simply need to get others to follow our lead.

pompano
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:45 pm

Hear, hear.
Sleep tight.

Leaf
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:46 pm

Amen brother. I need to head out as well. Have a good night everyone.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:47 pm

peace

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:48 pm

HAHA!! and even drunk slammed me participated. Cheers man

EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:34 pm

Personal story and a moment of respect – when my ex-wife became pregnant with our third child – six months after having our second child – I was elated but she was pissed. She actually threw some shit at me. Well, long story short, she wanted to get an abortion. I was dead set against the idea but told her that I would support whatever decision she made. She decided for the abortion. We went to the clinic – I was in the waiting room for what seemed forever when I finally asked to see her. They were getting ready to wheel her in for the abortion. I tried to talk her into changing her mind. My ex-wife expressed reservations as well. The turning point was the worker there – She told my ex that, if she had any doubts whatsoever, she should not be there. We went home and decided to have the baby. Honestly, I believe that was the beginning of the end of my relationship with the ex. I do not believe she ever forgave me. I cannot look at my youngest without remembering that she was minutes away from not being here. I have to give kudos to that worker – she did not try and coerce my ex into going thru with the procedure.

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:37 pm

thanks for sharing … tough thing to deal with for sure

NovaChiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/25/2022 7:04 am

EA, the worker didn’t try to coerce your ex, but you did.
She had made her decision. You should have accepted it and supported her.

NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:43 pm

Political thread: 280 posts
Politics free thread: 28 posts
I think we have answered the “Why can’t we just talk football?” question

EAFOX
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:44 pm

Different results during the season

Leaf
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:47 pm

Very true. Probably different results on any different day than today as well.

Last edited 1 month ago by Leaf
NovaChiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:51 pm

Outside of game days, the most active threads have always been politically charged

EAFOX
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:58 pm

Try adding these topics to the football threads….
Alex Smith should still be starting for the Chiefs
Chiefs need to rehire Bob Sutton
Double hand amputee outperforms Mecole Hardman
DRob accused of sodomy – Victim claims he went the wrong way

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:06 pm

comment image

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:52 pm

How dare you…. HOW DARE YOU…ugh. How dare you imply that Mecole hardmen can catch better than a double arm amputee. Ugh, you sir are spreading misinfo….SMH

EAFOX
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 10:05 pm

Sounds like it is time for another controversial list from EAFOX

NovaChiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:16 pm

Well, that would do it

pompano
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:51 pm

love watching football, talking about it bore me most times, other than victory threads, of course….there’s dancing ladies.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:56 pm

Gonna hop over there
I will say this….

I think abortion should be legal for
anyone under 16
rape/incest
life of the mother
the latter 2 are very rare

KCChef
KCChef
06/24/2022 9:41 pm

Haven’t read anything yet except thereis 10 times more posts on the “Politics Allowed ” Post … Democracy is Speaking … And It’s Pissed !!!

pompano
Reply to  KCChef
06/24/2022 9:52 pm

fuckin’ A, B and C!

EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:20 pm

The problem is when laws intervene with morality. Always a dangerous combination. Some believe that abortion is murder and some do not. The simple question is whether or not abortion is a fundamental right covered by the Constitution. It is not listed specifically but does it have a connection. If so, the government has the obligation to protect abortion rights. If not, the Constitution leaves it for the states to decide.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:27 pm

the states will decide and then the federal government will insert itself cause it is such a mess

we waste everything we touch it seems

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:29 pm

But what are laws if not morality codes determined by the people? I mean, we can go down the whole anti realism debate if you want, but that is a whole worm hole in of itself

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:31 pm

ahhhhh … so where is it written that there’s only ONE set of morality for all of humankind?

who says your religion is better than mine, or that mine is better than anyone else’s?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:02 pm

I’m not religious. But this country and most successful civilizations have a moral code . Our laws are base on a certain moral code. Do you deny this?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:07 pm

nope, I do not

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:29 pm

Ok then, Glad we can agree. So do you think as the most evolved species in the history of this planet, that we have the responsibility to protect the most vulnerable among us?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:34 pm

yes, which is why I favor a woman’s right to choose … women ARE the most vulnerable among us

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:37 pm

lol. many leftists would disagree with you

EAFOX
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:36 pm

I believe that most people would agree that we should have the freedom to do whatever we want as long as it is not harmful to another. Forget about morality for one second. If the first statement is true, then it comes down to when the fetus is determined to be a living being. Is it at conception? Is it when it can sustain life outside the womb? Using that concept, a woman should be allowed to have an abortion for whatever reason she might have until it is a living person. I am sure that you will say conception but others will disagree.

pompano
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:55 pm

Jewish law says the woman’s life must be considered 1st and obliges an abortion if it is at risk.
The living over the unborn.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:44 pm

True. “If she is at risk” you will get 90% of people to agree there. It’s when she’s not that’s the problem. most arguments against abortion are that at that point both the mother AND the child must be considered.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 11:40 pm

at which point, the law encompasses financial, emotional, psych as well as physical heath, also the bible says life begins at 1st breath.
it is the woman’s choice, always.

Leaf
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:46 pm

comment image

EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:09 pm

Well, if we armed the fetuses with assault weapons, that would cut down on the number of abortions.

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:11 pm

hot damn … NOW you’re making sense!

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:19 pm

About fucking time. I was beginning to think he never would 😜

Last edited 1 month ago by Leaf
EAFOX
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:21 pm

AND all fetuses should be required to wear KISS makeup and join the KISS ARMY!!!!

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:22 pm

just when I was holding out some glimmer of hope for you …

Leaf
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:36 pm

comment image

EAFOX
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:42 pm
saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:05 pm

hey hey hey…now… we only kill each other on this thread. Get lost with your harmonica;)

pompano
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:59 pm

that’s something we can all get against
😃

pompano
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:57 pm

or register vaginas as conceal carry holsters

EAFOX
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:02 pm

Would want to be a cop who gets to search for a weapon

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:08 pm

unless it goes off …

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:40 pm

First of all, this will NOT make abortion illegal across the board. States will now decide (which is the way it should be) what laws and restrictions they will now place on abortion. That is number one. TWO, we have already been trending this way the last several years. States like AL and TX have the ”heartbeat” law while NY and VA support later term abortion all the way up until childbirth. So while this is a HUGE ruling on paper, the impact isn’t nearly what people think

EAFOX
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:42 pm

Sure it is – just wait

pompano
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 8:50 pm

if you live in TX it’s a 900 mi + trip now, if you are allowed out of state whilst pregnant *hyperbole on the last part, but some bills have that kind of language*

also, investigating miscarriages will become normal in several states

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:52 pm

How about personal responsibility? A condom is what ? 50c? Easy to avoid these mishaps

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:00 pm

a woman who’s raped doesn’t come under that “personal responsibility” thing …

just sayin’

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:08 pm

ok .. so now we have to base policy bas3d off of 1% of cases? Yikes, many people won’t be happy

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:13 pm

you still don’t get it …

sadly, you never will

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:32 pm

come on MR Big brain. You are so much more intelligent than I am. So it is incumbent on you as you have the more/ intellectual high ground to educated a pleb like me using the most simplest of you all white/suburban education

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:31 pm

So if a bill hurts 1% of the population and also further the development of humanity, we have to nix that bill?

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:02 pm

.

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:10 pm

just like vaccines, contraception is not 100%, never will be.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:06 pm

so now we care about that?

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:04 pm

You’re right that it’s not a federal ban and states like Missouri or Texas will ban it while states like California or New York will encourage, fund, and use as commodity the discarded human tissues and organs of the fetus.

But fuck that we’re not resting on any laurels here. We’re going for a national ban next and after that a campaign convert every shuttered planned parenthood in this country into a monument to the 70 million victims of human commodification’s most barbaric form.

pompano
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 9:08 pm

Planned Parenthood’s budget is less than 10% abortion related.

upamtn
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:12 pm

wait … are you suggesting that they also EDUCATE people???

*gasp*

what a concept!

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:15 pm

nope

just put em to work for the bosses in the field

we need white field workers

upamtn
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 9:23 pm

never happen … they don’t pay enough

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:51 pm

Don’t care. Monument

pompano
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 10:00 pm

what is Monument?

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:06 pm

The very thing I told you we are going to build on top of the shuttered planned parenthoods across this land… you know exactly what prompted you to remind us that yes in addition to being the chief offender in the industrial slaughter of 70 million they also manage to use most of their money as a patronage network to hand out cozy sinecures to their friends and allies.

You guys really struggle sustaining thinking eh

Last edited 1 month ago by Sudden
EAFOX
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 10:08 pm

Leave it to Saints to be the reasonable one.

pompano
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 10:53 pm

still think this is saints alt account 🙂

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  pompano
06/25/2022 1:36 am

You people are fucking delusional. You call people conspiracy theorists for questioning the motives and practices of powerful entrenched institutions that peerage in shadowy ways and yet every time you see a comment online that hurts your fee fees you legitimately believe it’s a bot or sock puppet because you’re too damn solipsistic to acknowledge perspectives other than your own.

NovaChiefs
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 9:49 pm

And you wonder why people are upset.
use as commodity the discarded human tissues and organs of the fetus” What the hell is this ranting? Balance those meds, please.

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:54 pm

I don’t wonder why you’re upset. I want you to be upset.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:17 pm

seems I like John Anderson

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:21 pm

seems according to Missouri law I was not my stepdads son

55 years

He was my dad on my birthdays, my football and baseball games, I was their helping him in the fish shop, taking care of the pets, and the property

I HATE Missouri, such a backward damn state

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:41 pm

imagine if your mother aborted you. Would you support that?

Last edited 1 month ago by saints_chiefsfan1979
upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:43 pm

is she had, how would he know?

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:50 pm

Saints is a little slow

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:55 pm

lol… since you went there.

comment image

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:17 pm

You are male

none of us males have an actual right to say anything on reproductive rights

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 9:36 pm

SO I have to pay for a child (as a male ) I don’t want for 18 years?

NovaChiefs
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:49 pm

Most of the time, you deadbeats don’t so what’s your point?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 10:08 pm

don’t have kids, took precautions to not have one. Again, responsibility

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:06 pm

should one have to start at conception?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:09 pm

If I going to have sex with a woman, I should be prepared for the possible result. This also goes for the woman

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:53 pm

we can go into the meta verse and see things through a virtual window like A wonderful life

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:01 pm

ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

right then

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:07 pm

Never heard of a hypothetical? Alrighty then

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:12 pm

more of a metaphor?
not sure.
short story?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:36 pm

wrong
a metaphor is like saying ”this salad tastes like crap”

a hypothetical is when you take a situation and use it to illustrate a point

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:05 pm

that’s a simile.

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  pompano
06/25/2022 1:16 am

Up’d, and y’all know I had to.

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:50 pm

i couldn’t say…

Sudden
Sudden
06/24/2022 7:56 pm

https://i.insider.com/5730c9e852bcd029008c1bdb?width=1200

Lmao the people that spent 2 years trying to deny me access to the world for not taking a less than worthless experimental gene therapy are now claiming that bodily autonomy is the highest virtue as cover for their anti-humanism. The people that spent every year since 2016 invoking OuR dEmOcRaCy as nebulous, undefined and contradictory to orwellian degrees platitude now condemn a decision that reasserts democratic rule by the people through their elected representatives over judicial fiat.

Stay mad

EAFOX
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 8:15 pm

Nuke the bastards!!!!

upamtn
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 8:18 pm

all I’m a say s that I did NOT vote for or elect the people who made today’s decision happen …

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:23 pm

The beauty of this country is someone, somewhere can always make that statement.

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:25 pm

You also didn’t vote for any of the scotus justice in 1973. But you do vote for the representatives in your statehouse who will through legislation delineate the scope of what is permissible or not within your state. And by nature of the very union itself you can choose to move out of that state to one that more thoroughly reflects your values should you deem that legislative decision insufficiently favorable to your electoral choice. And that’s something the other side hasn’t had the ability to do since 1973. It’s the real pro choice position.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 8:33 pm

he did

Missouri sucks and he moved to Colorado

upamtn
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 8:39 pm

so … a woman gets raped, becomes pregnant and she HAS to carry that child to birth and beyond, etc etc … or what, move to another state?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:46 pm

Just 1% of women obtain an abortion because they became pregnant through rape, and less than 0.5% do so because of incest, according to the Guttmacher Institute. Yet the battle over exceptions for both has garnered outsized attention in the national abortion debate. 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/05/24/rape-and-incest-account-few-abortions-so-why-all-attention/1211175001/

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:54 pm

less than 1% are after 21 weeks, and drops every week after that.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:56 pm

only 150 abortions in Missouri is not a matter in 2021

we have that in mass shootings

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:51 pm

Or do whatever political organizing you can to try and effect change in legislative policy, you know, that whole democratic process that you claim to be such a devout adherent. Something that people with the other view have not until now been able to do because of a disco era judicial fiat. At whatever point you have given up any hope of effecting that change you seek because you are outnumbered in the state, yes you may leave. Could be worse than moving from Missouri to Colorado or California to Idaho. I’m already at that point with America. When I leave California, I leave America with it and the land my family has called home for 350 years.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:54 pm

If I got raped I would move regardless

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:04 pm

The ironic thing is if liberals had fought for laws pro abortion only for extreme circumstances like rape, it probably would have passed at a fed level and this day never would have happened. But everything they always tried to push was to open ended to sway the moderates

upamtn
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:09 pm

maybe, hard to say

but simply having one’s own “personal choice” in the matter is how it SHOULD be … personal choice, not a legal matter

IOW govt should “stay out of the bedroom” … private lives should be, you know, private

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:12 pm

do you think the Govt has a responsibility to protect American lives? Simple question

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:16 pm

not when a fetus is involved, very complicated actually, hence our predicament

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:18 pm

If left to its own devices, what will happen to a fetus?

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:24 pm

it dies

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 9:38 pm

in the womb? How have we survived as a species?

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:14 pm

it often does, miscarriages are commonplace. my mom had 4 I think.

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:17 pm

define life …

in a broad sense yes: that’s what the military is for

then too, if you think an un-viable fetus is “an American life” but don’t believe in helping out AFTER birth then what’s the point? forcing a 15 yr-old girl who made a mistake to carry a child to term and then be a mom and raise the kid for 18 years with no job and no money, where the kid is starving and there are no resources to help out as is often the case … well, that’s pretty much cruel and unusual punishment

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:19 pm

So we should have no responsilities ?

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:23 pm

only in Ben Ghazi it seems

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:17 pm

Disagree, because the child isn’t given a choice. The father isn’t given a choice, even though they are partially involved with the child’s creation. The only choice anyone cares about is the woman’s. When it comes to extreme circumstances, I don’t disagree with you that they should have that right. They shouldn’t be forced to carry a child of rape or a pregnancy that would kill them. The problem is thinking that they are the only choice that matters when it’s not extreme.

upamtn
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:24 pm

fair thinking …

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:45 pm

But you DID vote for 7$ gas, inflation, food shortages, possible nuclear war. But at least you white knighted for women killing their babies. Hope that makes you feel good

comment image&ct=g

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:51 pm

seems very slow

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:52 pm

funny, but I don’t remember anything on the ballot about oil companies gouging customers with obscene prices and making obscene profits from said prices, nor was there a ballot question as to if I’d be in favor of Putin turning into Hitler and starting a war of attrition against Ukriane , neither was nuclear war on the ballot to the best of my recollection (although the possibility has been around for decades)

as for “women killing their babies” I think there should be a “compromise” … ALL MALES should have a “reversible vasectomy” … thus eliminating the possibility of a woman becoming pregnant by virtue of incest or rape (reversible if/when said male gets married or whatever and WANTS to have children, etc etc ad nauseum)

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:57 pm

ummm gas prices were going up before ”Putins price hike”. But hey, Put labeled Ukraines as a bunch of Nazi’s. So you should be all for him invading Ukraine, right?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:02 pm

wrong, since Putin is lying … do you even recognize that fact?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:06 pm

Hold on…. I thought we have to believe EVERYONE who accuses someone of being a Nazi?At least attempt to be consistent instead of Neo Liberal hack…PLEASE

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:14 pm

*no one said that

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:20 pm

he has

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:09 pm

who?

upamtn
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:23 pm

pay no attention to the Saints behind the curtain …

EAFOX
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:25 pm

I say this with humor and sarcasm and affection – His birth was an abortion gone wrong.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:37 pm

LOL. My mother would agree!

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:20 pm

wait

castration

thus only the priviledged GOP asshats can father children

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:52 pm

i knew you would add something substantive.

KCChef
KCChef
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 10:03 pm

Uhhh … Democracy literally means “Ruled by the Many’ … Yet 5 of the Supreme Court Justices that voted to Overturn 50 years of precedent were placed there by 3 ( Republican ) Presidents that Lost the Popular Vote ( And the 3 appointed under trDump apparently lied about Roe’s status as decided by precedent ( Stari Decisis ) in their confirmation hearings … 75-80 % of Americans support a woman’s autonomy in medical decisions … A compromise between Early vs Late term Abortions has been effectual for decades …To not allow a woman this RIGHT , Which Clearly falls under “Liberty ” – ( See Freedom ) reduces them to 2nd Class Citizenry

Leaf
Reply to  KCChef
06/24/2022 10:11 pm

We aren’t a pure democracy (and we shouldn’t be). We are a Democratic republic. It’s not perfect, but no government is. Not even a pure democracy

pompano
Reply to  KCChef
06/24/2022 10:12 pm

HIPAA laws derive for the same…
 nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:14 pm

The crux of this issue has always been the “life” vs “Liberty”. One woman’s library is a denial of another’s life. One child’s life is a denial of her liberty. There’s never going to be a perfect solution.

Doughboy66
Doughboy66
Reply to  KCChef
06/24/2022 10:14 pm

Not a democracy. The USA is a constitutional republic

Doughboy66
Doughboy66
Reply to  Doughboy66
06/24/2022 10:17 pm

People also ask
What does the term constitutional republic mean?
A constitutional republic means that it is one in which, rather than directly governing, the people select some of their members to temporarily serve in political office; the constitutional part means that both the citizens and their governing officials are bound to follow the rules established in that Constitution.

upamtn
Reply to  Doughboy66
06/24/2022 10:19 pm

the constitutional part means that both the citizens and their governing officials are bound to follow the rules established in that Constitution

too bad the last guy didn’t believe in that part …

Last edited 1 month ago by upamtn
Doughboy66
Doughboy66
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:27 pm

Meh, Id take that back 10 times over the shit show Brandon has going on.

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:37 pm

There is nothing in the US Con that allows for abortions. You can be for it against them, but you can’t fault them for not being bound to a law that doesn’t exist.

upamtn
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:39 pm

wasn’t referring to abortion

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:47 pm

Lol my bad. Trying to keep up with all the conversations isn’t easy

KCChef
KCChef
Reply to  Doughboy66
06/24/2022 10:34 pm

i was defining the word ” Democracy ” which Sudden just above said was ” nebulous, undefined and contradictory to orwellian degrees ” …Also pointing out it’s hypocrisy as applied to the Justices weighing in on this rancorous decision especially in light of their apparent deceit under oath at their Confirmation Hearings , Public Sentiment , Established Precedent ( Stari Decisis ), the compromises already in effect to molify all but the Radical extreme right ( remember when the word “Radical ” seemed to only refer to the Far Left ? … Good Times … ; ) & the paring away of a woman’s liberty. until she becomes Second Class Citizen to the State she resides in …

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  KCChef
06/25/2022 1:31 am

The existing prohibition on state enforcement of abortion was decided by 9 robes. The overturning of Roe restores that question to the people of the individual states through their elected representatives. But hey if what you really want is to diagnose the federal judiciary I’m with you man, I want to overturn Marbury v Madison.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:51 pm

Good luck guys tonight

I doubt sex is happening

upamtn
06/24/2022 7:31 pm

had a DIY 1/2-lb grilled cheeseburger … my cost: $3 (including bun and cheese)

full pint of chilled homemade Bloody Mary Mix (basically a Virgin Mary) … est cost: 75 cents

I’ll take it any day …

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:45 pm

It is not the best way to go but I rarely eat all day, buy my groceries and eat in the evening

I have never had covid, my dogs eat more frequently than me, I drink much more than they do !

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:31 pm
upamtn
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:36 pm

I want the truth …

EAFOX
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:40 pm
steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:47 pm

I was awesome in a JV singlet, like 25 and 4

Varsity? like o’fer, those Mofos would tear your arms off

rip58
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:50 pm

You can’t handle the truth…….

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:26 pm
steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:27 pm

In a perfect world we all find our soul mates the 1st time out

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:17 pm

I did, my wife did not. Shit happens.

upamtn
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:19 pm

yeah it does …

EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:20 pm

The Supreme Court is now looking at that pesky amendment that gave women the right to vote.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:23 pm

awesome

lets live in the 1820’s

in the metaverse

I saw a woman today all dressed up in mennonite garb, nice SUV, pumping 5 dollar gas

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:48 pm

comment image

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:05 pm

OPEN THE PIPELINE THAT WASN’T FINISHED SENDING CANADIAN TAR SAND OVERSEAS!

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:30 pm

America takes Euro’s to

pay for it Europe

Leaf
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 8:21 pm

Okay chill man. I get you don’t like this, but you are just being melodramatic. there is nothing to suggest that is even remotely true.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 8:25 pm

probably not

a bridge to far MAYBE, I can assume that maybe that this court will not overturn emancipation?

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:25 pm

?

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:34 pm

Ya know i used to think the slippery slope was a fallacy. I was saying that in the early 2010s to anti gay marriage people. But now prepubuscent boys are being paraded on stage in skimpy drag in front of adults with varying sexual paraphilias all while said impressionable and whimsical child is being subjected to life altering pHARMacueticals based on mass psychological conditioning the like of which no totalitarian state before could ever dream of.

So yes, Clarence Thomas has been playing the long game since 1991, plotting a multi-decade course toward banning interracial marriage so he can get a divorce without paying alimony.

EAFOX
Reply to  Sudden
06/24/2022 8:40 pm

???

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 8:35 pm

Get real. Thomas’ rambling about gay marriage and contraception are devoid of support by the other eight, and this isn’t the first time he’s gone there, and not even the second. Nobody signed on then, either.

Sudden
Sudden
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:37 pm

Sorry Jack, we ain’t stopping until we’ve repealed the magna carta

pompano
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:41 pm

the judical door has been opened, regardless, someone will walk through.
we were assured RvW was settled law during confirmation hearings

upamtn
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:42 pm

apparently a few someone lied …

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:48 pm

Except that RvW never settled the issue, and it’s been contentious ever since. That battle’s been simmering the whole time, and has contributed to the current style of political discourse. RvW wasn’t the first time the SCOTUS has reversed a long-standing ruling, and those times didn’t open any doors.

Thomas’ unsupported concurrence can’t even turn the knob. Sorry to interfere with your outrage, but his opinion isn’t going anywhere.

pompano
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:57 pm

Casey supported it.

upamtn
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:57 pm

one small point: those who DO favor Roe v Wade have never ever wanted to “force” their morals on others: IOW, nobody on “that side” of the discussion has said that anyone else HAS to get an abortion (rather, it’s been about Personal Choice)

now, of course, it’s entirely different … the “other side” is saying “you don’t HAVE a choice and WE control you” … and that’s just wrong

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:00 pm

Bullshit!! the left has been trading on their extreme views getting forced don the the throats of voters for years vis the courts. Now it comes home to roost. Be careful of what you push

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:06 pm

sorry, but I’m calling BS on your BS

nobody on the left has EVER said “everyone should get an abortion because WE say so”

never

ever

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:15 pm

The left celebrates abortion. Calls it a rite to womanhood. Are you kidding me

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:21 pm

so nice that you know what’s inside the mind of EVERYONE who isn’t you

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:22 pm

so is abortion a difficult choice?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:27 pm

indeed it is

and one person’s situation may be vastly different from another’s

those who DO want/need abortion do NOT have an easy choice to make, and most often don’t WANT to have the abortion, but can’t see any other way to survive without it

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:41 pm

wrong answer. If it isn’t a life and only an undeveloped cluster of cell, then it should be a simple choice. The fact you say it is difficult heavily insinuates a moral dilemma involved. So let’s explore the moral dilemma

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:25 pm

not all that have abortions consider it a bunch of cells, your premise is flawed. as they often are

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:31 pm

depending on circumstances, it can be the ethical choice

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:29 pm

please.
might be a cultural meme somewhere.
“the almighty left celebrates abortion…hail satan” bullshit is just that

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:56 pm

It never should have been. Legal precedent is no substitute for the law. There’s a reason the US Con only allows congress to make laws. Ask the SC is supposed to do is interpret and determine constitutionality.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:23 pm

and long-standing deference to multiple precedence.
RvW withstood challenges and Casey was precedence x2.

Just like I think Heller flew in the face of multiple challenges/precedents.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:33 pm

Just because something is precedence doesn’t mean it’s untouchable.

upamtn
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:33 pm

oh, then it IS ok to overturn the 2nd Amendment …

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:39 pm

In theory you could. Amendments have been modified and repealed. Now that takes another amendment, but it can be done. Though personally I’d fight anyone trying to overturn the second.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:23 pm

amendments require state legs to agree, don’t see that happening in what’s left of my time.

EAFOX
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:25 pm

That is one way – amendments are notoriously difficult to add.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:31 pm

Nope. I wouldn’t count on it. Amendments are hard to pass and hard to take away. As they should be. They are hard coded laws.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:35 pm

so when should an abortion be illegal? After what trimester ?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:36 pm

for years it’s been after 2nd trimester … barring unforeseen medical complications

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:41 pm

So are you against these third trimester abortions that are legal up until delivery in some states?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:44 pm

unless it’s a medical emergency … that said, I’m completely against the 15 week law that many states are adopting (especially states that don’t even want to allow sex-ed in the classroom)

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:47 pm

I don’t care about sex ed (although we agree) I am trying to extract from you when you think abortion should be outlawed.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:47 pm

Sure. Absolutely . Now, I would never be in favor for that and fight against it, but a super majority could repeal 2 and what can you do(rememebr the 21st amendment)

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:22 pm

tradition and convention give weight to it when upheld.
that no longer holds like so many things we thought were rules, but are not, just stuff we thought we had agreed on, but never signed a contract to.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:32 pm

Weight, sure. Permanence, no. Rulings strengthen, or weaken laws, but they in and of themselves aren’t laws and shouldn’t be treated as such. That was RvW’s greatest failure

Last edited 1 month ago by Leaf
saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:50 pm

I draw the redline on that. We ALL have a right to life. Abortion is murder, plain and simple. But marriage is a civil/human right between 2 consenting adults whether they are gay or straight
We need a constitutional amendment to protect marriage

Last edited 1 month ago by saints_chiefsfan1979
upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 8:54 pm

We ALL have a right to life

does that include kids at schools and people at churches who would much rather NOT have some fool with a military-style weapon come in and shoot up 10 or 20 or 50 people?

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:58 pm

Playing devil’s advocate here, but every person that has an abortion ends a life, not everyone that owns a gun does. Not exactly apples to apples

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:00 pm

well only women can get pregnant

maybe let women decide on that instead of 4 old fucks in the SC

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 9:04 pm

So what if I want my GF to abort instead of being robbed of child support for 18 years ? What about that Mr white knight?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:10 pm

what happened to “personal responsibility”

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:14 pm

Since hypothetical is too far over your head, do I have a right to a say either way if a pregnancy is HALF my doing?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:20 pm

1) stop underestimating my vocabulary

2) a pregnancy is ALWAYS at LEAST half male’s fault (and sometimes 100%)

3) providing sex education and contraceptives can prevent a lot of your “hypotheticals” from happening … hypothetically

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:25 pm

OHHH!!! I AGREEE!!! You can’tbe Pro Life without believing access to birth control . Hell, You have my first thumbs up for the evening. Thank god we have condoms for FREE at every clinic and birth control is at an almost OTC cost to anyone who wants it. See, now was that so hard to agree upon?

EAFOX
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:27 pm

Damn – has hell frozen over?

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:29 pm

ran out of natural gas because of Putin

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 9:44 pm

or maybe Biden put a ban on fracking

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:15 pm

I hope so

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:25 pm

then keep paying 8 dollars a gallon. Then , you are probably a silver spoon Neo lib trust fund kid who doesn’t have to worry about that

Keep on virtue signaling in the free world

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:45 pm

hey, free condoms are why I don’t have children to this day. Well that and Whisky dick 🙁

EAFOX
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:48 pm

AND the women with sense enough not to sleep with you.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 9:53 pm

LOL… for them there were many, for me there wer many. I hate my lay count 🙁

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:43 pm

Ha!

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:03 pm

people who have abortions also give birth, quite often.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:12 pm

If they have an abortion it’s pretty impossible to give birth. More if you are referring to different pregnancies, not really applicable because it doesn’t change the fact that the abortion ended a life.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:21 pm

to so according to VA and NY

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:38 pm

obviously referring to women that have had abortions then later brought a preg to term, I know several. You prob do as well.

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:43 pm

I’ve had a friend who is a very very close friend to this day stain my shirt because she was so destroyed over having an abortion. So much so she passed out, And this is years later mind you when these conversations took place

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:41 pm

I feel for her. It can be devastating,

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:43 pm

But that’s not what I’m arguing so that’s irrelevant. Ups was comparing the act of an abortion to the act of owning an assault rifle. What that woman does another time is as relevant to my challenge as if the gun owner has any other deadly weapons. They aren’t what’s being compared

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:43 pm

there’s the rub.
when does “life” start and when is it granted rights/protections that supersede the person hosting that life.
Does a woman simply become the vessel for said life with no say in the matter?

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:04 pm

But she did have a say (expect with extremes, but I think I’ve made it pretty clear I’m for the women in those cases). She chose to have sex. There are consequences to actions pure and simple. You rob a bank, you might get lucky and not ever get caught. But if you do, you can’t complain about going to jail. I’m not telling the women to not have sex, but she should understand the risks that come from said choice.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:39 pm

so the consequence should be bearing a child she does not want?
Again is the man who had sex with her held to a similar standard?
It was/is commenplace for the dude to pay for the procedure to get out of an unwanted situation.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:48 pm

He should be. I’m not against making sure he understands the consequences either.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 11:54 pm

but she literally “bears” it, her choice ultimately.

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:01 pm

what about ectopic pregnancies. 0% survival for the fetus, very dangerous/life-threatening for the mother?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:03 pm

So we laws based on the very fringes of the mean?

upamtn
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:04 pm

but you’re all for punishing those who DO need and deserve it?

how very open-minded of you …

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 10:14 pm

How about we focus on the 99% of all abortions first and then decide the last 1% . What a novel concept

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:31 pm

Ok, the 99% are born to unprepared, unwilling, unloving, resentful parents….that’s a good thing right?

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 9:35 pm

“for the life of the mother” is excluded from several bans on the books….that exception cannot be made?
That baby will not live, and the mother must die as well, how very moral.
Sorry Bob, they both had to go, God’s plan and all.

pompano
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:36 pm

forcing someone to carry a dead fetus is helpful how?

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:15 pm

Is breaking a man in half finacially cool as well? See how I play the game

pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:26 pm

poorly

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:51 pm

now, tell me you aren’t saying I am some fundament list Christion. I am a little drunk, don’t mean to straw man if I read that wrong

Last edited 1 month ago by saints_chiefsfan1979
pompano
Reply to  saints_chiefsfan1979
06/24/2022 10:28 pm

was not my intent, but your arguments do align

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 8:27 pm

gay marriage?

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:37 pm

What about it?

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 8:40 pm

Thomas’ opinion says they should revisit that decision, and others

EAFOX
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:41 pm

He mentioned three specifically.

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:42 pm

One Justice, who’s never had the support of another on that topic.

I disagree with Thomas, but I don’t have an existential fear of him holding those views.

EAFOX
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:45 pm

Supreme Court cases are like Lay’s Potato Chips – cannot stop with one.

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 8:52 pm

Let me know when a case comes there that he can weigh in on. I won’t hold my breath, nor will I worry about his influence on his divergent colleagues.

But I’ve said this repeatedly, to no effect. I’m back to the other thread. Let me know if someone actually gets my drift.

pompano
Reply to  BleedingRedAndGold
06/24/2022 8:56 pm

it’s not Thomas’ opinion, it’s how it will be used.

BleedingRedAndGold
Reply to  pompano
06/25/2022 1:20 am

I didn’t expect notification. Accurate again.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:00 pm

It’s not an amendment, unlike woman’s right to vote, which is what my comment was on. I’m not saying it should be overturned, but it’s not exactly on the same legal security.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:18 pm

understood, but RvW was considered const protected, until it’s not

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 9:28 pm

It shouldn’t have, that’s the problem. There’s a reason why it was so contested over the years. Nobody is complaining that women are voting. Not a single rational person. Rational is the key word there. Everyone feels it’s right. It’s not in danger in the least. RvW has been contentious for years for many different reasons. No one in their right mind should have just accepted it was permanently safe. Hell I remember in my HS American Gov class talking about how it could change some day.

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:18 pm

agreed, while most agree in principle no one wanted to do the nitty gritty of codifying it, and here we are.
Wish there was a woman’s voice in this covo.

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 10:35 pm

True. I wouldn’t be against debating the issue with one as it affects them a lot more than me.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:19 pm

We should all have those

EAFOX
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:19 pm

The possum!!!

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:14 pm

gonna be interesting when and how women on the right start to realize what they have supported happening. Just like their male counterparts, they have pushed an agenda that has now restricted their rights to self choice.

Leaf
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:18 pm

Yes and no. Things will undoubtably be more difficult in certain areas, but not all. This ruling wasn’t about taking rights away so much as it’s about putting the decision to a more local area. Something I’m not totally against.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 7:20 pm

I don’t disagree

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 8:22 pm

having to travel 500 + miles for a procedure is not “local”

upamtn
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:23 pm

it would be IF local municipalities can “override” state abortion bans …

pompano
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 8:28 pm

yep

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:26 pm
Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:28 pm

Don’t like the rules in your state, fight to change them. The problem is people don’t try to solve state problems (which ironically is easier then fed). They just always go cry to momma/pappa fed to make a blanket rule for everyone when not everyone wants the same thing

pompano
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 8:31 pm

I do feel responsibility for ignoring midterms for 2 decades, thought the ship was on course…fool me once

Leaf
Reply to  pompano
06/24/2022 8:36 pm

Lol yeah, the political pendulum can swing pretty quickly in this country. Sad thing is things rarely change even when it does. Today is a rarity

Last edited 1 month ago by Leaf
steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 8:36 pm

truth

EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:14 pm

Should abortion be a fundamental right?

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:19 pm

see above

Leaf
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:20 pm

No. And I’m not against choice. But a fundamental right I have a hard time giving it.

upamtn
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 7:22 pm

Our obligation is to define the liberty of all, not to mandate our own moral code,” Justice Sandra Day O’Connor said in 1992 when she and two other centrist conservatives, Anthony Kennedy and David Souter, were key to preserving Roe.

(emphasis mine)

EAFOX
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:25 pm

Something that most Americans have no interest in doing.

upamtn
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:26 pm

(insert sad face here)

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:29 pm

most would be happy if the gobernment stays out of our shit

seems we just traded the US for State control

we did not win in any way today

upamtn
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:31 pm

thank you

EAFOX
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:32 pm

State politics just got more important

EAFOX
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:43 pm

I would have thought that they would have wanted the females to wear dresses.

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:57 pm

Doesn’t matter. The question was odds abortion fundamental. I don’t believe it is and that has nothing to do with a moral code. I think I’ve made it pretty clear around here I’m not much for religion

NovaChiefs
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 9:39 pm

What other medial procedures are you comfortable outlawing? Do people on vents HAVE to keep them going? Is killing an old person as bad as an unborn person? Is plastic surgery out because it is vain?
Medical issues are best left to the patient and their doctor.

Leaf
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 9:59 pm

First off abortion isn’t outlawed at the fed level (don’t give a shit about any particular state’s decision for this argument, because that’s a different issue). Second, the question is, is the right fundamental. I say no, because it’s not a clear cut issue. There are times I believe it’s okay, and others is not. If it was a fundamental right, it would always be okay; plan and simple.

NovaChiefs
Reply to  Leaf
06/24/2022 10:15 pm

I didn’t say it was federal. I said it was a medical decision between patient and doctor, and you didn’t answer the question.

Leaf
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 10:28 pm

The point is that it’s not outlawed like you said. Because of that it’s not a logical question. I also pointed out that this isn’t clear cut issue that is black and white. There are many spectrums of grey here so it’s not an easy question to answer. But I’ll give it my best shot because you want it so badly, I’m worth medical issues being between the doc and the patient as long as its only the patient being affected. And there lies the problem with abortion even if you are is medical. One side says there is only one involved party, the other other says two. Until that gets reconciled, it won’t matter much how many different angles take on this issue

saints_chiefsfan1979
saints_chiefsfan1979
Reply to  NovaChiefs
06/24/2022 10:27 pm

Should I be able to drive drunk? My body , my choice

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 6:36 pm

A question

It seems to me that the constitution was written for a secular society, since most of the inhabitants came to America to either escape religeous tyranny or to actually eat and substain their families.
Who gave this court the right to create a religeous based America?

probablyamistake
probablyamistake
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 6:48 pm

The answer for evangelicals is obvious. IMO they are wrong. Nothing in the New Testament says Christian have any right to impose their will onto a society. We are called to serve, not rule.

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  probablyamistake
06/24/2022 6:59 pm

I love the statement

but, why did the Crusades happen, the Spanish Enquisition, the Irish rebellion vs England?

upamtn
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:07 pm

power and control

religion itself IS power and control (and big money) … yet the fear-mongering goes on about “liberal indoctrination”

yrs ago I had a fabulous history professor at UMKC (Stan Parsons) who came up with the “Parsons Power Principle” …

to wit: People + Guns + Money = Power

it’s been that way since forever …

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:11 pm

that is distressing

EAFOX
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:13 pm

EAFOX + alcohol + marriage + food = one huge ass ex-wife

steve_chiefs
steve_chiefs
Reply to  EAFOX
06/24/2022 7:17 pm

Kansas has a choice this August to stop this in your state

Unlike Missouri

I bow down to the Kansas , just this once on being smarter 🙂

upamtn
Reply to  steve_chiefs
06/24/2022 7:24 pm

Missouri has a choice to stop Eric Greitens … boy do I hope he’s stopped

Leaf
Reply to  upamtn
06/24/2022 7:24 pm

Shit it goes both ways on the indoctrination. Don’t pretend it doesn’t