Fanpost: Top 5 Chiefs Quarterbacks

 105 replies

A FanPost by ForeverRanger

It is the off season for the NFL but with the draft a little over a week away at the time of me writing this, I figured it might be fun to do some rankings.

What kind of rankings? Let’s go positional rankings with five greatest Chiefs to play a certain position. Let’s go ahead and get the QB’s out of the way shall we?  This is going to be painful.

  1. Len Dawson- To start of we have Len Dawson.  The lone Chiefs QB to play in the Super Bowl as a member of the team, Lenny owns most of the franchise QB records.  After Dawson retired, the Chiefs went through a long period of average to mediocre QB’s. Dawson is one of 10 members of the Chiefs lone SB winning team that are in the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
  2. Alex Smith- Oh boy am I going to get some heat for this one.  Look, Alex is not a great QB by any means but he was an above average QB and was the bridge between bad and Mahomes.  In his time here, he never had a losing record and helped lead the Chiefs to their first playoff win in 20 years. He was a polarizing QB for sure but I know I am extremely grateful for his time here.
  3. Trent Green- Before Alex, Green was the best QB this side of Len Dawson.  He was never an elite QB but played well enough to lead the Chiefs to two winning seasons.  His numbers get overshadowed by the other offensive players but he was still a decent QB. He is still close to the team, calling their preseason games every year.  His best chance to win it all was in 2003 but sadly the Chiefs had ZERO defense once Maslowski went down. The team got older and was losing players every year because King Carl decided to go all in since Lamar was in failing health.
  4. Patrick Mahomes- No way could I leave Mahomes off this list.  The defending MVP was 6 inches from taking the Chiefs to a Super Bowl in his first full season as a starter all the while having a horrible defense.  He had the 3rd greatest season for a QB posting over 5000 yards and 50 TD’s, something that had only been done twice before.  He also topped Dan Marino’s records for a first year starter and he is only going to get better.
  5. Steve DeBerg- Steve DeBerg was an alright QB for the Chiefs and one tough SOB.  He started the string of decent QB’s that the Chiefs would get from the 49er’s.  In his time with KC, he had a couple of winning seasons but nothing would come of it.  This was a tough one and I seriously considered having a three way tie in this spot but that wouldn’t be right.

There you have it folks.  The five best QB’s in Chiefs history and dear lord this was painful to write.  Not only because the Chiefs QB situation is far from the best but also the fact that this is the second time I am writing this.

 In the next part of this series, we will be looking at the Inside Linebackers.

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dablueguy
dablueguy

1)Lenny
2)Mahomes- Already has passed everyone else, and only a matter of time until he’s #1.
3)Trent
4)Alex
5)It was tough between a few guys, Montana(not enough time and was pretty done when we got him), Krieg, Deberg, Cassell(yes, really), but ultimately I went with Bill Kenney.

Streetcleaner
Streetcleaner

1) Len Dawson (for now)
2) Pat Mahomes, no doubt in my mind the best QB we’ve ever had. But until he gets a ring he sits in 2nd place.
3) Alex Smith All he did was have winning seasons while he was our QB, and he brought us our first playoff win in 20 years.
4) Joe Montana Great QB, made AFC championship game. But he was a mercenary.
5) Trent Green Lots of regular season production, zero playoff success.

Falco16
Falco16

The more I look there are only 6 guys that should even be mentioned for top 5. I wouldn’t argue with any of these six. In virtually any order. Pretty much all other QBs don’t even get to be in the room if you ask me.

Len/Pat/Joe/Alex/Steve/Trent

legal_kush
legal_kush

You cannot leave Joe Montana off the list; he took them to an AFCCG. Sure, it was on the road and he got concussed, still… Trent Green would probably agree to defer his spot.

backbone313
backbone313

For all the love Alex Smith gets for this reason or that…

I can find this reason or that for Deberg, Krieg, Bono, Gannon, Grbac and even Warren Moon.

Problem with each and everyone of these QBs had shit shows for talent around them.

Until Mahomes, the Kansas City Chiefs have been the Checkdown kings of the NFL for a very, very long time.

Hard to throw Smith so high, when what he accomplished has been accomplished since 1989.

MidKan Chiefs Lifer
MidKan Chiefs Lifer

1) Lenny the cool, the SB pic with the smoke and fresca alone will keep him in this spot until the end of this next season.
2) Mahomes, he is the most talented QB to ever play for KC and in one season starting has already taken them to the brink of a SB.
3) Alex Smith, he was really good to pretty good for KC.
4) Deberg, this could be where I remember something that is not actually true but I’ve always remembered him as being a great Kansas City quarterback.
5) Joe cool, 2 seasons SB aspirations in both.

Berserker
Berserker

DeBerg was a decent QB, smart, tough, very likeable, in a time when dissenting opinions about public sports figures did not get much spread. Basically the Alex Smith of his day.

Leaf
Leaf

he was one tough mother fucker.

MasterChief
MasterChief

I would switch Deberg and Montana, but otherwise right on!

1) Mahomes will take the #1 spot when he gets a trophy because I think overall he’ll be better than Lenny when it’s all said-and-done.
2) Lenny the Cool will always be the in the top 2 for me. I recently watched some Len Dawson highlights and he was more Mahomes-like than I realized. On one play, he even went off his feet like a shortstop and threw a dart across his body for a completion.
3) Alex Smith is #3 without question (for me). He was much more of a dynamic player than Montana. Montana running the ball looked like a baby moose and I was always afraid he would shatter into a thousand pieces like he was made of porcelain.
4) Joe Montana got us as far as Mahomes and was a pleasure to watch play.
5) Steve Deberg was tough and had a mean play-action. He was the QB around the time I became a fan. I’ll never forget him playing with a broken finger.
6) Trent Green. He was solid. EDIT: I might have him tied with Dave Krieg at #6.

Chiefsfan115
Chiefsfan115

Patrick Mahomes is the best QB the Chiefs have ever had. Yes, i know he hasn’t won a Super Bowl yet, but Len Dawson was not the main reason the Chiefs won SBIV. He played in 8 regular season games in 69. Len had 9TDs and 13 INTs. Only one of those games did he have more TDs than INTs. 1 game of the 11 total he played that year, he had a Passer rating above 100. He threw 6 passes that game. Dawson’s best TD total was 30, and he was never NFL MVP.
By comparison, Patrick Mahomes has played well every game so far. You can’t place the blame on him for any of the 5 losses he has played in. He has 2 games so far with more INTs than TDs.

Tyrone
Tyrone

This except Machines x5
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tsv0728
tsv0728

Lol..nothing like a good Smithfights! to get the comments flowing. As has been said, it really depends on how you define top or greatest. I’m not comfortable with any list that puts Joe Cool below AS11 though, and I respected Alex’s game. Besides, those couple of years were very formative for me as a Chiefs fan. Just old enough to really know what was happening, and the most famous QB of all time was ours. It really cemented my fanaticism. So I’ll do…(like I said, it depends on how you define)

1. Lenny
2. Joe Cool
3. Pat Magic
4. AS11
5. TrINT

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

It was really tough for me to figure out the 5 spot on this list. Lenny, Alex and Trent were the 3 gimme’s. Then it came down to Mahomes, who I had to just because of what he did in his first season. In my original draft I had a 3 way tie between DeBerg, Montana and Cassel. DeBerg got the nod over the other two because of longevity, which is what I used to break any “ties” I had. Maybe it was because I wasn’t around for Montana I wasn’t as partial to put him higher up.

Berserker
Berserker

Honestly, I think your age has a lot to do with your partiality toward Alex. And Cassel, for that matter. If you’d seen DeBerg play firsthand, there’s no way you’d have any dithers about putting him above Cassel.

And similarly, my dad has a better opinion of Kenney and even Blackledge than I do. And I’m sure that’s because he actually saw them play, while all I can do is look at their stats.

What I mean is, back when I watched DeBerg play, I thought he was the best Chiefs QB since Dawson. But that was only because he was the first successful QB I’d personally seen in a Chiefs uniform….

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

In your defense, have you looked at the QB’s between Lenny and DeBerg?

Berserker
Berserker

Well, no, and that was my point. Those QBs happened before I was watching the Chiefs, so all I can see of them are numbers. On the other hand, my dad did see them, and he tells me that a couple of them are better than people like me who didn’t see them “remember” them being.

DeBerg’s Chiefs were successful (after Gansz) almost entirely because of their defense. But young me just saw the Chiefs winning, and DeBerg making some good passes for them without screwing up, and so I just assumed that DeBerg was doing a great job.

Falco16
Falco16

DeBerg and Trent are both deserving of top 5, but anyway I try to get to it it’s as a tie at 5. I can’t pick one.

Len (Ring)
Pat (MVP)
Joe (multiple playoff wins)
Alex (most wins in 5 year span)
Steve/Trent

BDChiefsFan
BDChiefsFan

i think Mahomes will climb higher after another “winning season”?

Trent Green had only 2 winning seasons with the Chiefs? wow.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Two winning seasons and one 8-8 season. Aging veterans and some bad drafting killed those early 2000’s teams.

Berserker
Berserker

No doubt. I don’t know if I’ll ever figure out how Peterson et al managed to put together an Oline like that.

For all the criticisms against King Carl, he and his FO did manage to pull off two near miracles – that Oline, and building Marty’s defensive roster. That’s actually quite a bit of magic in a relatively short time, in terms of roster building.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

If it weren’t for his FA signings and Lamar’s bad health, I seriously doubt King Carl makes it to 2009.

Leaf
Leaf

Maybe, maybe not. He built contenders for Marty and Dick. It didn’t really start falling apart for him until Herm. So he more likely than not would have made it to at least 2007.

Falco16
Falco16

Herm’s downfall had a lot to do with miss management as Dick was leaving. The talking heads wanted to call KC a great opening, I saw it as an overrated situation.

The line aged out with no plan for replacement, and the the defense was so horribly neglected during Dicks rein.

stjoechief
stjoechief

The whole point of rankings is that no one will ever agree 100%, so it stimulates discussion that can sometimes get heated. I don’t see anything too bad in the comments but then, this is generally a pretty civil group. I’m good with the names put up but can see the arguments for others. I’ve always appreciated Alex Smith a bit more than many. Arguing between Alex and Trent Green basically comes down to which had the better supporting cast. Green’s teams had a much better O-line, while Alex’s had mostly better defenses. So I’d call it a wash there. It’s close, but I’d give Alex the edge because !!!QBWINZ!!! Patrick is going to be at the top of that list very soon, but one season isn’t enough IMO. For #5 you could make arguments for DeBerg, Montana (quality vs. quantity), or Kenney (often hurt and on bad teams but solid when healthy). I think DeBerg had the best Chiefs career of the three but wouldn’t get into a bar fight over it.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

I can take criticism but I regret even making this list. I expected to get heat for putting Alex at two but damn. That being said, I stand by this list completely.

workingmansdead

I haven’t seen anything too harsh. Just roll with it, man. Own it! It’s all in good faith.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Luckily I chose to get this one out of the way first.

BleedingRedAndGold

Putting this here so it’s visible to you. Just a quick comment that I happen to have one of the worst up/downvote ratios on AG – the only one who’s up there with me for downs is Anthony, and his upvotes dwarf mine.

That said, by that score, support for me here’s running almost 8-1 in my favor. Also, if you feel you could use advice on anything you write, or tips on how to write, shoot me an email. Just because I don’t write very well doesn’t mean I don’t know about style, structures and grammar, etc.

Berserker
Berserker

Downvotes, pfft.

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BleedingRedAndGold

As I know from long experience, negative feedback can eat away a person’s confidence, but you’ll also notice that I pointed out that my feedback’s got a good ratio, so that’s what I’m paying attention to and using to try to encourage Ranger a bit.

Also easy to say when you’ve only got a little over a third of the downvotes I do, lol. I’m not sweating them, though, not in this community, ’cause I know y’all got my back, too. Meanwhile, I still have a lot of rebjuilding to do, so I try to stay positive and focus on the positives. Can’t always manage either, but it’s a work in progress.

Berserker
Berserker

Hell, I don’t even know how to see my own up/downvote count anymore. It used to pop up when I’d hover the cursor over my profile pic, but since that stopped happening, I haven’t bothered to figure out where to find it.

You can’t obsess over something if you don’t acknowledge its existence, right?

Leaf
Leaf

Click on the “i” or your name and it pulls up a few stats.

BleedingRedAndGold

Chin up, Ranger. From my review of the comments here, you’re getting some supporters for including Smith (count me in that group), and very little heat over him. I’ve taken more heat over some of the things I’ve written, so just put on your asbestos undies, Nomex suit, and keep on truckin’.

IMO Smith could have beaten the Colts in the playoff game at Indy, but the turf monster ate too many of our premium players. Lost Jamaal early, and then his backup, leaving him with a 3rd-stringer who probably got very few practice snaps, if any. And that’s just the beginning – and even then it took the Colts getting lucky on a fluky play to win the game. But viewed through the lens of the “Smith sucks!” narrative, he gets blamed for the loss, when he shouldn’t be.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

I am just a little on edge since Max hasn’t gotten back to me so I can get the KC Kingdom show on the road.

Leaf
Leaf

No worries. We are family here so we don’t take offense to your panties being in a bunch 😜

BleedingRedAndGold

Heh, I get that, but then again, I have extensive experience with being nervous and jittery. If it falls through, check and see why, and if it’s something beyond your control, tell’em, OK, didn’t work this time, but if things change, you know where to find me.

Always in motion, the future is, so unless you need a job fast for eatin’ money, you can afford to be patient. Even Robert A. Heinlein, who was notable for the quality of his short stories had to shop some of them around to multiple publishers before they paid off. Writing’s a marathon, not a sprint. One of his maxims is that if you want to be a writer, you must write and keep writing.

Team Player
Team Player

It started us talking. Isn’t that what it’s supposed to do? I’m not sure what your goals were, but I think you met them.

You are, of course, wrong, as is everyone else who doesn’t agree with me.

workingmansdead

Remember when he overthrew Cyrus Gray? That sucked.

BleedingRedAndGold

Was he the 3rd stringer behind Knile Davis, or the other way around? Anyway, my point on the Indy game stands regarding that, because when it comes to RB receiving, reps matter for the QB, too. Gotta get some timing down, so with Charles going down early, there went about 90% of the RB practice snaps that Smith had worked on.

Berserker
Berserker

….Which is why, if your 3rd string RB is all by himself deep down the sideline, and a road playoff game is on the line, you don’t try to hit that 3rd string RB in stride – you try to hit him in the face.

Good pass, bad decision. Just like so many of Alex’s passes.

Falco16
Falco16

Yeah I put Alex on mine, and anyone that isn’t blindly hating on him should IMO. As much as I hate the QbWiNz argument he was the QB for 5 years and the franchise won more games in those 5 years than in any half decade span previous. That counts for for something.

I also think any QB on most of these lists could have done the same thing. That speaks to how good the Chiefs have been the last 6 years under Reid. This team had franchise historical success with a QB that I was glad to be rid of. I’d still say the same thing if Pat went 4-12 and looked like Leaf. Alex is squarely in my Top 5 (4th), but of the 6 on my list he is the last one I’d take.

Part of it also shows how few good QBs we’ve had. A QB with only two winning seasons (Green) makes many if not a majority of top 5s (mine included) along with journeyman (DeBerg also on my list) that is also heavily represented.

Also sad to point out only one of the QBs on any of the lists was drafted by the team.

CHIEFSandSABRES

Take it easy on yourself Ranger. It’s a fanpost with your opinion on the top 5 Chiefs QBs. Great list, and more importantly, great convo starter and contribution to AG!

vvet818
vvet818

I would reverse #’s 2&3 and say ok to the rest of it.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Zero Playoff wins and the lack of winning records put Green below Smith.

Falco16
Falco16

I concur. I’d still take Green over Alex, but as far as “top 5” real life numbers 11>10.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Keep in mind that this was how they did with KC. Montana might be one of the greatest QB’s in NFL History but he only played with the Chiefs for two years. In the case of a “tie” I took into account number of years played with the team.

Leaf
Leaf

True, but Montana’s two years were glorious. He might not have the longevity of Smith or Green, but he did more for the team in those two years then both of them. And that’s just the sad truth of chiefs QBs. A two year flash in the pan is still considered among the best in org history.

Nasrani
Nasrani

Thank you for mentioning Alex. I know he’s taken a lot of flak, and his fans have too (though notably less here than over at the Abandoned Place, where it seems people were just trolling), but he brought us out of a losing drought (that time between Trent Green and Alex was… painful. Tyler Palko? Really?) – over that seven year span we only had one winning season that I can remember, and two 2-14 years.

One thing I think you forgot – Rich Gannon. I’m not sure how long he was with us, and he did go over to Oakland (boo) for a long time, but that 1997 year was fantastic. I think we would have won that playoff game* if we had had Gannon at the helm.

*I will maintain until the day I die that Tony Gonzalez came down with the ball in the back of the end zone. KC 17 – Den 14.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Forgot about Gannon but this was how they were with KC. How they did with other teams was completely irrelevant.

KCChef
KCChef

1) Dawson
2) Mahommes ( He’s gotten us as far as Joe did in essentially the same time frame + You Know, The Future : )
3) Montana
4/5 ) Smith / Green or Green / Smith

slackator
slackator

1. Len Dawson
2. Patrick Mahomes (for now)
3. Joe Montana
4. Trent Green
5. Steve DeBerg

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Montana over Smith? Montana was with KC for two years.

starry1
starry1

Why is length of stay even in the equation? Montana is better than AS11, period.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Because this is the best five CHIEFS QB’s. How Montana did with the 49er’s has no bearing on this list.

Berserker
Berserker

Montana got us to the AFC Championship game, by beating Houston when Houston had possibly the best team in the AFC.

Alex Smith came with us to the divisional round because Houston had Brian Hoyer.

Montana accomplished more in his two years in KC than Alex Smith accomplished in his entire career.

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

5 winning seasons, 4 of which the Chiefs went to the playoffs and he would have at least 3 playoff wins if the defense could hold a lead. I get that people think Alex Smith is Palko tier but I looked at every possible thing in making this list.

Leaf
Leaf

He might have, but he didn’t. Montana might have won us a SB had he not got injured. See we can play the what if game too.

Berserker
Berserker

Alex should thank the Chiefs for giving him most of those things you listed. Not the other way around.

Two very silly things to say:
– Smith = Palko.
– Smith was a better Chiefs QB than Joe Montana.

And that’s ^ the reason Alex fans get trolled, even now. Because you’re actually serious about the silly stuff you say about him.

BleedingRedAndGold

I don’t think Ranger’s terribly serious about Smith’s absolute ranking as a QB, and given the standards he’s using, i.e. wins, accomplishments, and longevity, it isn’t unfair to put Smith over Montana, since by those standards Smith accomplished everything that Montana did save getting to the AFCCG, but other than that did more, for a longer time.

On an absolute level, Montana’s far and away better than Smith, but with the the boundary set at “Only consider time at QB for the Chiefs”, the argument for Smith over Montana is valid, even if not everyone agrees with it. I’ve stated that I think Montana should be on the list over DeBerg, but where he ought to be on it, I’d have to consider that pretty long, since Montana “broke the Mile-High curse”, and took the team to the championship game. But that would take time and math, and I’m tired right now.

Berserker
Berserker

Not serious as in I’ll fistfight you over it. Serious as in not joking or deliberately exaggerating when he makes the argument that Smith was a better KC QB than Montana.

On the other hand, if somebody does say, “Alex is as bad as Palko,” that’s pretty much always a joke, a deliberate exaggeration.

The difference between Montana and Smith is just like you said earlier – Montana elevated this team in his short time here. While on the other hand, Smith was lucky enough to have his career elevated by Andy Reid while he was here. And that’s pretty much all the comparison that matters. Otherwise, counting up years and wins and whatever details, that’s just an exercise in obfuscation, trying to grow a bunch of trees in which to hide the forest.

BleedingRedAndGold

*Shrug* That’s beyond my involvement, since I was talking about this based on Ranger’s standards. I’m not the one who set those standards, so I can go no further.

But it’s his piece and his standards, and you have every right to disagree with them. And since you seem to be taking this comparison outside his standards, I’ll see ya on the next topic. How the pen did better than the starting pitcher in today’s Royals win, perhaps. 😉

Berserker
Berserker

Well, if we don’t discuss the standards by which the rankings are created, then there’s not much to discuss about a ranking, is there?

author- “So, here’s the list I made based on the standards that I like.”
reader- “…Yup, read it, and it fits the standards that you like.”
a- “Yup.”
r- “Yup.”
a- “Yep.”
r- “Yep, well, see ya next thread.”

Personally, I think the longevity thing is a cop-out, a standard with no particular virtue over other standards, selected purely as an excuse to elevate Alex up the list. Just like your comment against disagreeing with an author’s opinions, is a cop-out to end the discussion on your terms….

I will not argue with you about the Royals. That would be like…somebody….arguing about….some…. thing that they don’t know anything about.

BleedingRedAndGold

I know a little about a lot, but a lot about very little. But I disagree with you about there being no discussion about how QBs (in this case) fit within those standards. I don’t see it as an excuse to put Smith in there, though. Back-to back AFCW champs, won at DEN three years running, first playoff victory in forever, good enough for Reid to build a really good offense around, smooth transition to Mahomes with his help – those aren’t chicken feed, if you’re talking team accomplishments for a given QB.

Unless, of course, one wants to move the standards to include coaching as an excuse to exclude a QB. Not saying anyone here owns that position, just a hypothetical. Seriously, because that’s not a platform I’d care to discuss in any6 depth, for various reasons.

BleedingRedAndGold

Side note: I have a Marine friend, medically retired for disability, and we argued a couple military points on and off for several years, on a now and then basis. So it took a while before we realized tha5t we were basically advocating for pretty much the same things, but our language and POVs were so radically different that it took a long time to become evident.

Stuff happens. And to me, that stuff happens to me a lot. 🙂

Berserker
Berserker

Of course you have to take coaching into account, when you’re talking about how valuable a QB is to his team.

People do that all the time with Mahomes. “Mahomes just fell into the perfect situation here in KC…” Sound familiar?

Why, then, do some folks take such exception when it’s pointed out that Alex Smith also fell into that same “perfect situation?”

Cop-outs, excuses. Hypocrisy. They all abound, but it seems especially around Alex Smith.

MasterChief
MasterChief

I’ve got Smith > Montana ONLY because I think he was a more dynamic player with his ability to run.

Berserker
Berserker

Gah, you fans of running QBs….

slackator
slackator

Yes and I stand behind it. Montana is 1A as the greatest ever and his 2 seasons were fantastic for the Chiefs. I also dont give credit to Smith for not blowing a playoff game when the defense spotted him something like 30 points. I know there are still his defenders on here but I will never put Smith as great because he choked big time when the games mattered and rode coattails and Reid in the regular season.

BleedingRedAndGold

So you’re blaming the loss to the Colts at Indy against him?

ForeverRanger91
ForeverRanger91

Alex still had to make the reads and the throws. Wasn’t like Andy was controlling him via remote control.

BleedingRedAndGold

Between SF’s HC antics and his shoulder injury while there, I can’t help but wonder what would’ve happened, had he went to Reid. I can’t prove it, but I think SF broke his willingness to try to go next-level, and he pulled into a shell of efficiency and effectiveness. He was both of those, but he couldn’t pull a rabbit out of his ha…er, helmet when the situation demanded it.

As a QB qua QB, Montana was far better, because he could pull a hat out of a rabbit at any time. Unlike Smith, he had the confidence to perform on the big stages, and rightly so. That said, trying to compare them directly is silly, the game changed too much between them, due in no small part to Montana himself. Smith never got to that level, but if he keeps it up, Mahomes looks likely to do it, as well.

Leaf
Leaf

As much as I love DeBerg, Smith was the better QB.

slackator
slackator

but I dont consider Smith to be a good QB and I had to make a list of 5 so DeBerg gets in by default when in reality Chiefs have only had 3 good QBs in my lifetime not counting Gannon and Lenny goes #1 by default until Mahomes wins the SB (next year)

Berserker
Berserker

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Team Player
Team Player

How did you arrive at “5”?

To me it’s 3 clear tiers:
Lenny and Pat
MontanaGreenSmithKinneyDeBergKrieg
…and the trash heap

MasterChief
MasterChief

Thanks for reminding me of Dave Krieg! I might put him at 6 instead of Green, or have them tied.

workingmansdead

1. Dawson
2. Mahomes – will easily pass Len the instant he wins a Super Bowl
3-30. Meh